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Liverpool Fans – Deluded, Spiteful And Fickle. The New Newcastle?

I automatically have a deep mistrust, resentment and loathing of any football fans that bestow upon themselves the title of “Best Fans In The World™.” Not only does this statement indicate a willing and almost purposeful ignorance of the abundance of other incredibly passionate, committed and supportive fans of other football clubs from all around the world who may be worthy of such a title, it also seems to surmise in most cases that being the “loudest” fans translates into being the “best” fans.

Think of Newcastle fans, one such group of self-proclaimed “greatest” fans. They seem to define being a great fan as protesting outside the club at 11am on a Tuesday morning when everyone else it at work, because the local post-box hasn’t been proclaimed as an accurate, 1:1 scale representation of Kevin Keegan’s phallic endowment, or something to that effect. Had it not been for the astringent criticism and heckling of one Sam Allardyce in the form of protests and the like by the Newcastle fans back in the 07/08 season, Allardyce would probably have still been in a job come the end of the season and, based on what most experts and pundits believe, they would have most likely not been relegated that season. However, the fans believed that their “passion” justified their deluded, myopic beliefs, and that their actions only went on to enhance the credibility of the claim that Newcastle fans are the “best in the world.” Well, it now appears that Liverpool fans are in on the act as well.

Now I’m not making a direct comparison between the current Roy Hodson situation at Liverpool and the Sam Allardyce saga from Newcastle a few years ago here, there is one vital difference in that, on the whole, Hodgson has done a poor job at Liverpool and needs to be replaced by the summer at the very latest. However, I can’t help but feel that Liverpool fans have contributed significantly to their struggles this season and the massive fall from grace of Mr Hodgson, the way they’ve acted has resulted in what can only be described as a self-fulfilled prophecy. By having got on the back of Hodgson so early and by having set such high standards for him based on their blinkered vision of the standing and current ability of their own club, they’ve never really given Hodgson the chance to operate in a more constructive and productive pressure-free environment that would have been more beneficial for all parties involved.

But why did the Liverpool fans get on Roy’s back so early and essentially fan the flames of the fire that has all but burned to the ground what remained of their clubs traditions and dignity? Well it’s obvious; it’s because the Liverpool fans, just like Newcastle fans, have a massive messiah complex, and Roy Hodgson has the unfortunate disadvantage of not being Rafael Benitez (the flaws of whom I have delved into previously, link here)

Now before my face succumbs to a pugilistic rage of scouse fury, let me point out that Liverpool fans have also expressed similar sentiments to those above, and not just any Liverpool fans, some of the more educated of the predominantly deluded scouse rabble (link here)

Am I the only person who is starting to think that Liverpool are slowly becoming a poor imitation of Newcastle United?

Hear me out:

  • A club overly-romantic about past glory.
  • Fanatical supporters who believe they’re entitled to success.
  • A succession of beleaguered managers that have failed to win the title.
  • Fandom overriding rational logic.
  • Disgruntled players who see their future elsewhere.
  • A belief that a messiah in the form of an ex-player/manager will come and save the day.

You see, not such a far-fetched comparison is it? Some similarities are uncanny. The only thing missing is a fat, meddling, buffoon from London! Hold on, isn’t Roy Hodgson from Croydon? (ok, that was a little harsh).

As a Liverpool fan I’ve been perturbed and a little surprised about all the column inches Liverpool FC have been consuming over the last few days. There seems to be genuine hysteria emanating from the club.

It was embarrassing to hear cries of “Hodgson for England” and “Dalglish” from the fans during the recent home defeat to Wolves. Alright yes, Roy Hodgson hasn’t done a good job as Liverpool manager. Actually in truth, he hasn’t even done an average one but the level of hostility towards the man is becoming unacceptable.

Every interview he has conducted has been brutally assassinated and taken out of context. Even something as banal as Hodgson rubbing his face is now up for discussion on the LFC internet forums. Ex-players who in the summer were praising his appointment have now trickled out of the woodwork to publicly damn him

Liverpool fans are supposed to be the most knowledge football fans around (truly a self-proclaimed notion). Therefore, can they not see that the club as a whole is going through a rebuilding process and need some patience? A magic wand will not be waved and everything will be rosy again. No plaster or band-aid can cover over the mistakes made in the last 18 months.”

Patrick Barclay of The Tim

es has also made similar accusations of the Liverpool faithful:

“Poor though the team were [against Wolves], however, nothing insulted the club’s traditions more than the chant aimed at their manager, whom the FA has considered as a potential successor to Fabio Capello. “Hodgson for England” yelled sections of a support once regarded as fundamental to the fortress-like character of Anfield. Today, when Bolton Wanderers come, the same people will belt out You’ll Never Walk Alone without a whit of irony.

Anfield will always be a great place to watch football. But it has been belittled in the eyes of the wider game. The neutrals privileged to be there in May 2005 will always remember the winter when Anfield went flaky, not only pointing Hodgson to the door but holding it open – let’s not forget this either – to Kenny Dalglish.

My impression is that, although disgruntled Liverpool fans have a huge variety of alternatives o Hodgson in mind, most want Dalglish in at least temporary charge (the more delusional imagine that Pep Guardiola or some such luminary will beat a path to Anfield at the end of the season).

Some want Rafael Benitez – free after his dismissal by Inter Milan and still regarded by many as the club’s best manager since Dalglish reeled away, suffering terrible symptoms of stress, in 1991 – back straight away. But essentially there is a yearning for an icon.

Remind you of any other club? It would do if they yearned for Kevin Keegan rather than Dalglish. Sections of Liverpool’s support have come to resemble their Newcastle equivalents in times of disappointment: angry rather than sad, but still bereft. And now ready to welcome a messiah. Newcastle fans, weighing the respective merits of Keegan and Dalglish at St James’ Park, might even joke that they’ve picked the wrong one.”

I also can’t stand fans that state that their club “deserves” success and the recent turn in their fortunes, that they’re entitled to some silverware because of the years of under-achievement that they’ve had to endure (i.e. City fans), despite the fact that there may be a plethora of other “deserving” clubs out there (the criteria for “deserving” and “entitled” not having been defined of course). Well this is another unsavoury attitude that Liverpool fans have decided to adopt, lambasting Hodgson for not achieving the success that Liverpool, being such a massive and historic club, are “entitled” to. But no club, anywhere, is “entitled” to success. Yes, some clubs should be achieving more based on the resources they have available (City’s oil-money), but nobody is “entitled” to success, no matter how rich their history and traditions.

There is another great piece on the above issues by Lawrence Gray-Hodson at Three And In (link here) which I’d recommend reading in its entirety, but a relevant extract is shown below:

It’s been obvious since day one that Liverpool fans don’t like Roy Hodgson. To them he’s like a step-parent who has taken the place of their real dad. Yet they ignore the fact that their real dad was a rioja swilling buffoon who spent £20m on Robbie Keane. If Benitez was their real dad and Liverpool was their mum then their dad used to get into bad moods and slap her about the face a bit.

Yet when it’s your real dad you’re willing to overlook his flaws. Forget that he alienated your best midfielder so he could bring in the honest but limited Gareth Barry. Forget that when the title was there to be had his team conceded four goals to a Russian who barely moves from a 20 yard patch the entire game.

Along came Roy and he is kindly. He tried to win the Liverpool fans over by bringing them a present. “Hi”, he said, “I’m not trying to take the place of your real dad but here’s a Joe Cole to play with”. Granted, it’s a bit like getting second hand lego that has been chewed by a dog but at least the thought was there. From the start the famous Liverpool support turned their nose up at him.

That’s not support. That’s the opposite of support. You know the Scousers, so happy to wallow in misery that I bet many of them are enjoying this season much more than title winning ones because it means they always have something to cry about. I fully expect a group of celebrities to make a video about how Hodgson is killing their club. First it was Hicks and Gillett, then Hodgson, whoever comes next will be to blame I imagine.”

Now Liverpool aren’t the only ones guilty of having such fickle, deluded, short-sighted fans, lots of clubs are and it’s an increasingly modern phenomena, especially for the bigger clubs with larger fan-bases. United had the “Sack Fergie, Sell Giggs” brigade of the early 2000’s, but luckily the mini trophy drought at that time managed to filter out a few of the less committed fans. And judging by the attendance of roughly 35,000 for Liverpool the other night in a stadium with a capacity of approximately 45,000, despite the game being on a bank holiday and not being televised, I think that we may be seeing the true extent of the numbers of the Anfield faithful, and the contemporary identity of what is the modern Liverpool fan.

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No Responses to “Liverpool Fans – Deluded, Spiteful And Fickle. The New Newcastle?”

  1. JohnW says:

    No NEED what so ever to bring up NUFC fans. The difference is we pull in over forty thousand fans week in week out and we did pull in exactly the same in the CC. Would Liverpool fans do that????? I don’t think so. Try looking things up before you needlessly have a poke at other fans. Look, i know Liverpool are a HUGE club i only wish NUFC where slightly behind them but obviously they are not. 5 CL trophies to Liverpool’s name is fantastic to say the least. Liverpool and NUFC are hated by the southern softy media and are easy targets for cheap journalism. Well done, you have followed suit. (Band wagon). Good luck to Liverpool i am sure that they will be pushing for Europe once again by the end of the season. I on the other hand would be happy if we just stop in the EPL. Liverpool and NUFC are very passionate fans and we always will be.

  2. Chris F says:

    for one, we didn’t protest about allardyce while he was manager, protests only started after Keegan’s sacking.

    second, we didn’t get relegated the season we sacked allardyce, instead keegan came in and the club finished higher in the league than it was when allardyce was sacked.

    third, it’s sky and the rest of the media that portray the “best fans” schtick, true newcastle fans don’t label ourselves that way.

    all that aside, however, i can understand liverpool’s fans unhappiness at things currently going on at your club, but you need some perspective. Woy won’t get you relegated, though it’s unlikely he’ll get you into Europe either. The main problem he had is he was left a dejected and demoralised squad packed full of average, midtable players by Rafa (which makes those calling for his reappointment seem all the more delusional to me!) Gerrard and Torres have been carrying your side for a couple of seasons, the rest of your quality players having slowly been sold off.

    A new manager won’t make any difference right now, your club is on a downturn and it’ll take more than one man to revitalise it.

    Just be thankful you aren’t owned by Mike Ashley.

  3. Chris says:

    How dare you! How can a Manchester United fan label Liverpool and Newcastle fans as deluded, spiteful and fickle! I can remember a time a few years ago when Sir Alex started buying foreign players and your team went through a bad spell and dropped to seventh (yes seventh)in the premiership. How the mighty United fans bellowed, how Ferguson had lost the plot, they would support English teams like Watford! That is until the Mighty Reds went on a more productive run and climbed the table. Now that is the true definition of fickle!

  4. R Kilsby says:

    So you think all Newcastle fans are like the 50 or so morons that turn up to stand behind the Sky cameras to chant rubbish.

    I expect you see all students as violent hooligans!

    Is very dangerous to classify people and generalise on a group of people based on a tiny sample.

  5. David says:

    I stopped reading after you wrote that we got relegated in the season that Allardyce was sacked, it was the season after. Although I did notice that you put the similarities between us and them and I think you would find only a few delusional fans thinking the BS you have wrote. I don’t know one fan that thinks we are entitled to success and its been that way for years. Maybe you should get off your computer and actually talk to real people and stop believing everything the press says.

  6. lee says:

    Man U – Obsessed with Liverpool for half a century and will still be obsessed with us for the next half century.

    Man U fans:

    The fans who booed Ryan Giggs during a poor run of form in the early part of the decade at Old Trafford (No doubt this will be denied but it happened).

    The fans, known to their own captain at the time, Roy Keane, as the prawn sandwich brigade.

    The fans that called for the sacking en masse of old whisky nose a couple of years ago because you werent winning the title (Hes too old, hes losing it – thats what I remember reading on message boards and hearing on radio phobe-ins).

    So, stop obsessing about us and concentrate on your own club. For once.

  7. Red Jim says:

    As a Liverpool fan, I am ashamed to say that I agree with most of this article. Never in 20 years have I seen ‘You’ll Never Walk Alone’ abandoned to the extent it has been now. We have a proud history that too many fans have forgotten. But, as you say, those will have been the 10,000 ansentees the other night.

  8. rooneylovesnani says:

    Yawn. If there is one thing certain to wind up a Man utd. supporter more than any other it is the all-consuming passion, loyalty and dedication of supporters of other clubs – in this case Liverpool and Newcastle. It is anathema to the arm-chair-seated, Sky generation united supporter settled in for the Match of The Day highlights with their bag of doritos and prawn sandwich; that the supporters of more traditionally passionately supported sides would get at all worked up about the small matter of how their club is being run.

    Unlike the supporters of United, fans of the majority of other clubs are born into it – like it or not. They didn’t select it like a brand of cereal or evening class, as with the united lot. We are stuck with the club, and don’t have the luxury of switching to another side when the times are tough. I hope this helps shed some light on matters for you.

  9. Red Jim says:

    sorry, should be ‘absentees’

  10. Xhero says:

    Dear upset and fragile pool fan, this is excerpts taken from a number of sources of whom not all are man utd fans so chill out and open your eyes because next year may be liver pools year( just like it has been for the last twenty or so years)

  11. bill says:

    I think that you are under a misapprehension about Newcastle fans. Newcastle fans only want to see their team do well. I often wonder at their allegiance to Newcastle even when they are being taken for mugs by owners and directors. They may have a romantic idea about how the game should be played but how many clubs would have such support that hasn’t won a domestic trophy since 1955. My allegiances are split between Newcastle and ManU (where I live) and I do sometimes admire the fans that turn up, and at other times I think if I still lived there I wouldn’t go to games because of the owner. Also, don’t say Newcastle fans say they are the best, I have never heard a Newcastle fan say such a thing; it is the media that come up with that tripe. They turn up in their thousands, home and away but they would never say that they are any better than any other set of fans. We all love football and we all want our teams to do well, Newcastle fans just want, justifiably, their fair share of the spoils.

  12. Andrew says:

    Excellent effort at trying to get under the skins of 2 clubs who have clearly got under yours. You really have very little right to comment on Newcastle considering you have absolutely no grasp of the facts. Allardyce had an abysmal record at Newcastle in which we were absolutely languishing towards the bottom of the league (losing to teams like Derby – the only game they won that season!). There were of course a small section of fans who made it known they were unhappy but the way you are writing is like we drove him out with pitch forks. It was Ashley who sacked him, the buck stops with him. The results ultimately cost him his job. A glaring mistake in your piece as well is that we were not actually relegated that season – Keegan took over and we finished 12th – with a very strong finish to the season. It was the absolute mis-management of Ashley et al the following season and the horror show that was Kinnear that ultimately took us down. Now that had absolutely nothing to do with the fans. It was pure and simple just a string of terrible management decisions at the highest level. Get you facts straight mate before you go accusing fans of causing their own clubs to implode.

  13. gaz says:

    Although I don’t necessarily agree with the content of the article, I do think this is an important point – the way that Hodgson and his team have been supported this season has not been good enough, we are not Newcastle and we should make sure we never become anything like them.

    I felt that towards the end of Benitez’s time there was way too much sniping at the manager by Liverpool fans and it’s not something that should have been happening. With the Benitez stuff, a lot of it was from out of town supporters, whipped up by the press – it was certainly never there inside Anfield and I would say even despite last season’s poor performances, 60% of the fans wanted Benitez to be given another season. Unfortunately for him (and us as it turns out) he had already burned way too many bridges with the owners.

    So when it comes to Hodgson, not many people would say that this is a personal vendetta between Liverpool fans and their manager, but we have been even worse this season than last, and last season we had a team that was capable of much more, so realistically we were EXPECTING an improvement, not merely hoping for one. This is where Roy’s protestations that ‘it’s not my team’ have stuck in the throat a little bit – it was a good enough group of players to smash Utd at Old Trafford so it’s hardly rubbish and if he was any kind of manager he should have been able to motivate them to produce better performances. We know they are capable of it.

    The bottom line on Hodgson is that unfortunately he is just not right for LFC, he is the wrong man, appointed by the wrong people, at the wrong time, and for the wrong reasons. Liverpool fans may feel better when he is gone and I hope that most of us will recognise that Hodgson is not a bad man, not even a bad manager and leave it at that – I suspect that if the new owners bring in the right person then this will happen but if not – well then we couldn’t argue with being called deluded spiteful and fickle.

  14. Tom Addison says:

    Or maybe because, in case you hadn’t noticed, it’s United vs Liverpool on Sunday, and the Liverpool “Boo-Boys” have been all over the press lately?

    And what you doing scouring the United blogs anyway?! Bit of hypocrisy right back at you.

  15. John says:

    This is a load of crap the difference between Liverpool and Newcastle is Liverpool have had success and Newcastle havent, 2 years ago we were fighting for the title. The only reason this article has been write is because you like to take the attention away from your own shambles of a club, you might be undefeated this year and probably on course to win the league but it doesnt take away that you love the fact of things going wrong at Liverpool, take a look at your owners and sort them out before looking at Liverpool (who managed to drive there last owners out something you lot don’t seem to be able to do).

  16. Redman says:

    I wouldn’t say that we’re deluded, there’s nothing wrong with having expectations and it’s wrong to compare us to Newcastle on the basis that at least until the end of this season, we’re still considered as English football’s most successful team unlike Newcastle who haven’t won anything except “promotions” in the last 50 years – why shouldn’t we expect winning ways to continue?

    Should we be happy to watch others (namely your lot) take our place at the top of English football and not even put up a fight to retain our spot? I don’t think you would do that….

    And finally, why shouldn’t we hope and expect to have a top class manager to guide our team – Until Man Utd appointed a winning manager from Aberdeen, they didn’t and look where it got them.

    Unfortunately our board got carried away with the fact that Roy Hodgson was English and took Fulham to a European Final to look a bit more closely at his domestic record. Had they done that, maybe they would not have appointed him.

  17. MungoJolly says:

    “Allardyce would probably have still been in a job come the end of the season and, based on what most experts and pundits believe, they would have most likely not been relegated that season”

    Newcastle most definitely weren’t relegated that season- they finished 12th.

    Which is about as accuate as your article gets, to be honest.

  18. Gaz2 says:

    These things come in cycles – Liverpool had there day and as sure as night follows day once Fergie – almost a freak of nature – goes Man U will start there own inevitable cycle of decline and maybe one day regrowth….

    Only exceptions are “two party states” like Spain & Scotland where the two big clubs have so much more money then the rest they couldn’t fail if even I was put in charge!

  19. Chris Bell says:

    As a long suffering Newcastle fan I I have to commend this as a well written and referenced article. However… I should add that during the self proclaiming world’s best supporters song at the Toon, we even have middle aged women and girls singing along “We are the Geordies, the Geordie boot boys”. Now that’s not delusional, spiteful or fickle… it’s just moronic. Good job football isn’t very important eh?

  20. Geordie says:

    Let’s put a couple of things straight. Newcastle fans have never said that we’re the ‘greatest fans in the world’ that’s something the tabloids label us with. Also the job Allardyce was doing at Newcastle was awful. Did you actually watch us play Derby away when they beat us 1-0 and we didn’t have a single shot on target? Do you think the way our club is run justifies all of these protests, because I do! Newcastle’s crowds didn’t dip as much as Liverpool’s have even in our relegation season. I remember when Souness was in charge of Liverpool the crowds deserted the team then as well, remember we’ve had Souness football as well and still got 52,000 week in week out. Liverpool have lived off their ‘famous’ name for years and have been in the top 6 of the Premier League most seasons but when things get a bit hard the supporters don’t get behind the team. Welcome to our world!!

  21. bill says:

    People are not scouring United blogs Tom. If you go to Newsnow every club that is mentioned comes up under the club that you looking at, hence, Jack came up with Liverpool, and since I check both ManU and Newcastle stories your item came up on both. Don’t be so touchy.

  22. MR MOJO RISIN says:

    newcastle fans liverpool fans any fucking fans are better than you spoilt muppets and i cant wait for the day u crumble when taggart retires, debt debt and more debt, your real fans couldnt even fill half your ground.
    PS geordies never confess to being the best fans in the world, its the media, we are loyal to point of embarrasment but thats it we want the best for our club who doesnt, couldnt see all your home fans making the epic journey up and down the m1 then up the m25 if u lot were in the championship.

  23. King Torres says:

    The problem we have at Liverpool is that we have a squad that should be doing better. Roy Hodgson past record has never been one of a winner just a swedish title to his name in 35 years of management. Just 12 away wins, before taking over at Liverpool, in 5 seasons of premiership football!!!

    There has been blame over a squad that with Alonso finished second. Apart from that Roy got the same squad, then he had to sell Mascherano but Poulson as a replacement back Really. Add to that he got rid a young left back that had been promising although admittadly didn’t do well last year. But then replaced him with a 30 year old yard dog. Then signs Joe Cole and plays as defensive left midfield. Then signs Mereleis who played centre midfield all of his career and says doesn’t know his best position, WHY SIGN HIM ROY!!!! Lets Aqualni go when he is finally fit and looking a promising player.

    Oh then his sit deep whack it long tactics, then insults the fans, then insults Journalists from Denmark and Norway where our fan base is massive, and he attacks players in the press. The list of his faults goes beyond this. Basicly he has taken a job of small improvement and made it a massive job. He can not be given any more money and we need players now so he has to go, and I have never called for a managers head in my life.

    As for the next manager, I think its too late for Benitez now, although we should not have moved him on if there was nobody better, and we never got that.

    As for calls the for Dalglish as an interim manager, he’s more qualified than the man in charge and his status at the club might give us the lift we need, IF there is not a permanant appointment available.

    Any way I hope you enjoy your win at the weekend, I expect that Gerrard and Torres will be on the bench as all week Roy has been saying he needs to rest them at some point.

    By the way I have not been scouring united sites, this came up on news now.

  24. Billy McGooligan says:

    So you have a deep mistrust, resentment and loathing of any football fans that bestow upon themselves the title of “Best Fans In The World™”… you don’t, however, seem to have any sort of problem with people who like to tar large groups of people with the same brush and, quite frankly, verge on racism when talking about people from certain parts of the country… you know, what with you being one such person…

    What kind of person can claim to be so knowledgeable about football fans when they think the massive support of a football club is entirely made up of charvers with bed sheets that Sky Sports actively seek out when there’s a bit of trouble and strife going on at St James’?

    A miserable person lashing out and other clubs cos you’re not winning as many games as you think you’re entitled to…

  25. Mick G says:

    Watch it Liverpool if you are going to be the new “Newcastle” be prepared for the lies the media will make up and then the rest of the country jumping on the bandwagon.The so called deluded geordie fans was something based on opinions of less than a handful of numpties that follow every club,but it will be funny if you appoint Dalglish as manager surely there isn’t a L’pool fan in their right mind wants that.

  26. Steve says:

    A message for Thomas the tit Addison. As a Newcastle fan, I am supportive (both financially and vocally), loyal and protective of my great club and for the record have never ever seen my team win a trophy or ever likely to, nor have I ever EXPECTED my team to win anything just like 99.9% of Toon fans. I think (like other fans think of their own) that we are one of the most loyal and fanatical set of fans in the world yet you and your fellow journalists constantly look to provoke us with derogatory comments about us. Its Liverpools turn this week but no doubt your attentions will be turned to us again next week. You and your colleagues invariably know absolutely nothing about football and the impact both mentally and financially to a fan and his or her family. Many of us live and breathe football and pay for the pain/privilege to support our team. My advice to you is report on football and facts rather than use your lowlife gutter journalism to sell a story

  27. bill says:

    While I’m on, can you explain to me why ManU fans at Old Trafford always cheer when Newcastle are losing? I’m a season ticket holder at Old Trafford, and I do not understand this; unless it harks back to when Kevin Keegan was manager and his rant at Fergie. If that is the case, I think it’s time to move on.

  28. Chris says:

    I don’t think you have the right to publish this when you clearly know nothing about Newcastle united, you have no opinion and so mirror the media belief of Newcastle fans.
    Keegan took us from div1 to PL title challengers, that’s why he has been labelled the messiah. Name me one other manager we have ever called a messiah? It is all a myth.
    We didn’t get relegated the season allardyce left firstly, so there’s one incorrect fact you stated.
    The reason we did get relegated was because allardyce signed overpriced overrated mercenaries, for over inflated sums. Eg. Geremi £85 000 a week, and he made him captain!
    Our fans would take 17th place this season, I hate the way we are portrayed in the media as deluded.
    We haven’t won a trophy in 60years, yet still manage to bring in gates of 50 000 (what other club would get 52 000 to a championship fixture). So you may not think we are the greatest fans, but the facts say you can not question our loyalty.

  29. Stevie says:

    I quite often read peoples comments with regard to ‘how’ Newcastle fans think and feel. I am never surprised by the ignorance of such comments. I know many people who support Newcastle and Liverpool for that matter who just want their club to compete and play good football. Nobody I know thinks in terms of it’s our right to have success, or a messiah is going to save us. This has all been created by Sky Sports & other journalists and to back up their theory they find the stupidest person they can in a Newcastle shirt, probably offer him a 4 pack of Ace lager and then get him to talk any old rubbish. I congratulate Man U on their consistency and success over the years, however one day that will come to an end and when it does all the smug people like yourself will be on the receiving end of other peoples opinions represented as thier own and oh how we will laugh at the once mighty

  30. Cyprus-Toon says:

    Just one bit of info for you Manc, it’s not the Toon fans that say we’re the best fans in the world, its the pundits, the press & other managers that say that about us… so get yer facts right….. and all this coming from a club who majority of fans don’t actually live in the area of the club is ironic… lol

  31. thomas says:

    I am going to say that you have a point. As a Liverpool fan I agree that no club is “entitled” to anything and any LFC fan who says so is a fool. However the comparison to NUFC is well off the mark.

    Our fans are angry and frustrated and upset, not because we think we deserve better (apart from a foolish few which every club has), but because Roy Hodgson has been nothing but a huge step backward for the club. We are not an under achieving club, like NUFC, we are the most decorated in English football and one of the most successful currently. Rafa Benitez had his faults, but he made largely the same squad do better, in tougher league years, by some order of magnitude.

    Its all good and well to say that Liverpool fans expect too much, but only 2 years ago we nearly won the league (congrats by the way). I don’t think it is too much to ask for our manager to keep us in the lifestyle we have become accustomed to. Would Man Utd fans be any different? ?r Chelsea, or Arsenal? I think not.

    At the end of the day you are comparing apples and oranges. They are both fruit, but they very different in flavour.

  32. Lee says:

    Not sure why I’m lowering myself to write on the website of English football’s second most successful team but here goes….

    I find it astonishing that United fans and Evertonians etc are so infatuated by my club’s goings on, when they should be looking closer to home at their own problems….like a frickin’ huge amount of debt that your owners are racking up.

    Anyway, the simple fact of the matter is that Roy Hodgson wasn’t worthy of becoming a Liverpool or for that matter, any other top English club. His record is hugely unsuccessful and the ‘more time’ comment that every club attaches to us wanting to force him out is highly irrelevant. It’s the kind of sentiment you give to a manager who deserved to be in charge and actually had some decent pedigree. The way we go about getting him sacked is entirely our business.

    Could it be that you want him to stay so that we’re no longer in the picture?

    I for one hope you lot beat us on sunday so we can finally see the back of him. It pains me to say it but sometimes a bad loss can bring a heck of a lot of good….like a new manager who does have pedigree.

    Probably best to get back in your greenhouse

  33. Kev says:

    Must be perfect to be a Manchester United fan, maybe we should all just don their shirt and join the trend, what right do we have to a belief / wish that the clubs we grew up to love might actually win something one day.

    It must be fantastic to sit up in your ivory tower and have the cheek to rant at other clubs fans that have not had the luxury of a steady ship for so long, one thing for sure both Liverpool and Newcastle have a dedicated following.

    Should it ever happen to you and your club drops from favour then I guess you could always attend the other ground in the city..

  34. Leeds Utd will never be defeated says:

    Man Utd in the 80s.

    * A club overly-romantic about past glory.
    * Fanatical supporters who believe they’re entitled to success.
    * A succession of beleaguered managers that have failed to win the title.
    * Fandom overriding rational logic.
    * Disgruntled players who see their future elsewhere.
    * A belief that a messiah in the form of an ex-player will come and save the day.

    And if this was happening to Man Utd now, your fans would do the same.
    Only a few years ago some of your fans were calling for AF to retire during a slump.

  35. Red2death says:

    Well, here’s the litmus test:
    Try replacing Fergie with my dog. His tactics are “ruff ruff ruff, hoof”. Ok, maybe you be patient with him for a while, cos perhaps he just needs some time to settle in, gel with the team, get them hoofing the way he wants them to hoof. Berbatov, Hernandez and Rooney have stopped scoring, and Giggs can’t dribble or pass anymore under his system, but that’s ok, maybe they just haven’t got used to it yet.

    Quarter of the season in, it doesn’t look good, the title’s out of reach, maybe you can still get CL football next season though. Some fans getting impatient, but of course you’re Man Utd, you expected better from a new manager. And this continues – losing games not by luck, but because you never looked like winning them in the first place. OT has become the theatre of jokes, players present a united front but on the field you know they’re already very disillusioned at the new direction the club is taking and if nothing is done about it many will probably leave.

    It’s now midway through the season, results haven’t improved and they don’t look like improving. For CL, new even Europa league will be a challenge. Man Utd has gone from being champions to Europa wannabes, but the manager thinks that’s ok, you can’t expect to win every season anyway.

    As Utd fans, how long will you wait???

    If the answer is a long time, then all power to you, I suggest you consider having Hodgson replace Fergie when he retires. Give him two seasons to put his fine imprint on the Utd team. I can tell you that Liverpool fans all around the world will be rejoicing at that news!

  36. Robbo says:

    As an interested neutral, must say it’s gonna be interesting when Fergie finally retires and if Mourinho doesnt replace him. Just as the scousers expected success as a right by the late 80s, the Utd fans do so now. Its easy to criticize fans of other clubs when you’ve had constant success under the most successful manager ever, less easy to be smug when you’re battling for a top 4 spot season after season.

  37. corballyred says:

    Another joke of a journalist that just can’t seem to get his head around the fact Roy Hodgson isn’t a very good manager.

    The reason he wasn’t wanted is simple instead of listening to the tripe written by English journalists they actually took a proper look at his 35 years in management, they saw it was laced with medocrity, never winning a trophy outside Scandanvia, a low win rate, sacked 4 times, playing a negative brand of football wherever he went, winning the ridiculous LMA manager of the year award(previously won by George Burley, Joe Kinnear etc) even though Fulham finished 12th winning 1 away game.

    Ya I hear you he got into a Europa league final but then so did Walter Smith, Gordan strachan and Steve McClaren should they have got the job. Quoting Patrick Barclay then is the icing on the cake, reading Barclays ramblings since Hodgson was appointed I’ve no doubt Hodgson has Barclay on speed dial.

    I think the author should properly take a look at his record and not just the fact that Hodgson has presided over the worst start the club has had since the 50’s when Liverpool got relegated.

  38. ToonArmyMIA says:

    Whilst there was an element of delusion to NUFC fans, the VAST majority werent of the “messiah complex, etc”. The best thing that happened to us, to clear such an element out, was relegation. After initial sadness (not geordie crying),most realised that relegation got rid of small % of delusional, “glory fans” and over-paid players who didnt give a monkeys. The way we are playing right now, regardless where we are in league, is what every true NUFC fan always wanted; be proud to put on the b&w shirt.

    Most of us did not believe all was well at the time at the club and were pissed off with the piss-poor performances. Most of us didnt think we’d win anything either.

    As for “best fans” label, well every team claims its team is the best and hence the fans are best supporters. not that many actually give it due credit. its just the nature of football support.

    As for LFC, it seems a bigger fall from grace than NUFC. We hovered around relegation for a few seasons and the inevitable self-destruction of the club took care of that.

    As for MUFC, like every other team, there is an arrogant fan base who thinks other teams are just there for their entertainment and to provide 3 points. just read Fergie’s comments when they lose; its never the other team played better. Also, this season MUFC fans have a short memory. When Rooney announced he was leaving, the reaction was similar to LFC fans now. Difference being LFC fans didnt go round Hodgson’s house and give him death-threats.

  39. Collie McCabe says:

    As a near NUFC fan I must point out a few things….
    * A club overly-romantic about past glory – well we havnt had any recent success however our 3 FA cups in 5 years in the 50’s is still a better glory period then most other clubs!
    * Fanatical supporters who believe they’re entitled to success – thats bollox, if you talk to nearly every NUFC fan you will hear the same, we want a team that tries to play an attractive attacking game and always gives 100% for the shirt. yes we do feel we should be in the top tier however we certainly dont feel we are entitled to success.
    * A succession of beleaguered managers that have failed to win the title – considering we havnt won it in 84 years i wouldnt think this is a valid point!
    * Fandom overriding rational logic – You’ll find plenty of rational logic if you look beyond the pubescent bed sheet brigade pandering to the encouraging sky cameras.
    * Disgruntled players who see their future elsewhere – ha, for once at last this is way off, our squad is the most unified since Sir Bob’s 2002 squad.
    * A belief that a messiah in the form of an ex-player/manager will come and save the day – The huge proportion of mags were v happy with CH and didnt want him sacked, that was down to the board. I do see your point here however remember that Shearer is Newcastle’s greatest ever player and we were on the verge of being relegated with no hope in sight, it was worth a shot!! Also when Fat Sam got, deservedly, sacked why not appoint Keegan, his record at NUFC was fantastic, his record eleswhere was good and he loves the club unquestioningly (is that a word?!)

    Anyway well written article and worth the read however please talk to more genuine Toon fans and you might be surprised!

  40. Collie McCabe says:

    *near 20 year nufc fan

  41. Geordie Viking says:

    So when did Newcastle fans claim to be the “best in the world”? That’s a myth that’s been put around by the media. However, I think you will find that Toon fans hold the records for 2nd Div (post-war) and Chapionship attendances which is a much better measure than the club attendances for a club in the top 4 of the premiership. No club DESERVES to win anything, including MAn U. Trophies have to be earned nad no team can expect to be successful year after year after year. And, just to jog some Red memories, I’ve watched Newcastle score 5 and 7 against the self-styled Red Devils.

  42. Chris says:

    First off… I am a NUFC supporter. The overwhelming majority are also not claiming to be the best fans in the world. I do not expect the club I support to win anything, although it would be nice! There, that’s out the way. I know this article is primarily about Liverpool and I know it’s on a MUFC blog, but seeing as you wanted to bring NUFC into it… here’s my view from the N.E.

    While I think your post attempts to tackle a real problem in the game as a whole today… namely that fans as a whole now seem to want instant success (particularly in the premier league) and the subsequent problems it causes (see Liverpool) I think you have fallen into a few familiar traps too.

    I cannot speak for Liverpool or their fans, I do not follow them and it is not my place, however here is my view as an NUFC supporter – one who has finally grown tired of being told how I think by the media and everyone else.

    To generalize the supporters of the club based on the few spotty idiots Sky find outside St. James Park (or Anfield) for a quote whenever something has happened is a mistake. The same would be true of most fan blogs, at least those that I have personally read. Most of the ‘fans’ appear to be teenagers (at best) who’s football knowledge appears tied directly to Football Manager or equivalent.

    I think sports journalism today is by and large lazy… the number of times they make up news or turn a blog chat between fans into a headline story boggles the mind. It causes a lot of problems, but I also have an understanding of the business… they write what sells. So I’d like to know why so many fans of so many other clubs are so interested in what happens at LFC and NUFC in particular? That’s why they keep giving them column inches.

    I know a lot of NUFC fans, and none of them claim to be the best fans or that we deserve to win things. This now apparent given actually is yet another media label – we don’t like it either. The same is true of NUFC fans claiming that we are a ‘big club’ whatever that means. We do usually make the list of the top 20 clubs according to FIFA, which I guess is an accomplishment? The truth behind it is that we are however statistically one of the best supported teams in the country, and even in Europe, DESPITE the fact that we have not won a major trophy in what is rapidly becoming a half century. For evidence, look at away game ticket allocations or last year’s Championship. Despite being out of the top division, we still had one of the highest home gates in the country each and every week and perhaps even more impressive for a ‘big club’ almost every team in the division we played away had a record attendance – I believe the exception was Cardiff v Swansea, which is a local derby – and the record was in part due to the away fan ticket allocation. That doesn’t make us the best fans in the world, but it sure qualifies as passionately supporting your team through thick and thin. Maybe that’s fanatical. Has this been true of other relegated teams? Would it be true if Villa or Liverpool go down? Food for thought.

    Next, being overly-romantic about past glory… well that’s probably got the most truth to it. That’s because there hasn’t been any recent ‘glory’ to think about. Getting close to fifty years since there’s been a trophy, and there’re an awful lot of memories in that time. Can’t remember the figures for Liverpool, but I know it’s a lot more recent that 1969. Also something that MUFC fans haven’t had to worry about for a while now… credit where credit’s due.

    Totally agree that the number of managers we have had is ridiculous and it underlies why we haven’t been successful. That said, it has largely been down to the board and not the fans of the club. Also our figures are somewhat inflated by circumstance… e.g. Kinnear having heart problems, Keegan throwing a fit, etc. Allardyce was also not a popular manager for us. He got a tonne of money and delivered the most dull ‘football’ in return – and while that might just pass if the results come – well they didn’t, end of story. As for Keegan… in my circle of NUFC fans, there were only a few in the minority who wanted Keegan back. It was a PR attempt by the new owners that was most likely doomed to failure from the beginning and ultimately it did backfire. As for Chris Hughton & Pardew… this has caused some disagreement with the fans. I happen to think that Pardew’s doing a pretty decent job – we’re now beating the teams we should be and competing against the rest. I have a lot of respect for Hughton as a person, however I think he was axed early because Ashley & Co didn’t want a repeat of the relegation season – and we were sliding. You hear a lot about Hughton’s wonderful record… but I wonder how well he would have done had Ashley not bankrolled a largely Prem quality team in the Championship. Add to the list of what-if’s!

    As for Ashley, he gets a LOT of stick. Some deserved, some not. Personally, I think he does care about the club, even if only as an investment. He’s also the one who has to make the hard decisions as it’s his money on the line. I happen to think he’s done a lot behind the scenes with the running of the business side of the club and financially we are on very solid ground now. Ditto for youth development… we have some really exciting youngsters just starting to get to the first team, and a lot more to come. Carroll being the current star of the day, but there’s more, a lot more. Also having a manager on ‘normal’ wages with large incentives if he’s successful… what a novel idea, almost sounds like common sense!! His biggest mistakes are P.R. but he’s never been known for it in the city either. He doesn’t really talk, ever. This leads to a vacuum of information… and vacuums fill up quick with a lot of junk. Then the mainstream take the junk as fact and the whole thing spirals out of control.

    Also about the players… no-one’s disgruntled… in fact we have some of the best dressing room harmony I can remember and it’s helping us win games. This may be controversial, but I think relegation did wonders for us because it got rid of all (well ok most) of the dead weight. Might not be a bad idea for Liverpool to consider as they are carrying a lot right now.

    Not sure Liverpool’s decline is a big secret… forgetting about everything off the field like the stadium, etc. They have Reina, Gerrard and Torres if they can get him fit. Then they have a bunch of overpaid dead weights and some youngsters who appear not capable or not ready to step up. This season they have been found out. I’m not sure that even if they were playing well they’d be doing much better. I haven’t seen much of Liverpool play this season, but did watch the Wolves game and the game where they came up to us. I will say that morale appears in the toilet. Tired bodies and heads dropping far too quickly.

    I will also conclude this much-longer-than-anticipated reply. Despite the anger that has been at our club the team has always been supported. That includes the manager, with Pardew being the most recent example… not anyone’s choice as a fan, but once the decision was made he gets the backing off the fans until he deserves to come under criticism. Hearing the Liverpool fans chants was disappointing. It appears to me that Hodgson is getting the blame for the systemic problems he inherited, without any support from the board or now the fans. Hard to see how that’s going to help matters. Coming from a club that is undergoing something of a rebirth of our own and if nothing else should demonstrate what not to do… changing manager on a whim is probably not the answer. While sorry for Liverpool fans, I am glad that this season is opening up competitively and I hope we too finish above Liverpool in the league!

  43. David says:

    As a Manu fan you have been extremely fortunate over the last two decades to witness your clubs domanace over English football. This then begs the question, why so interested in the goings on of both Newcastle and Liverpool? As a newc fan I can honestly say that you like most others have based your opinions of the club on the muppets that get interviewed on sky sports news.

    Firstly we got relegated the season Keegan left, not big Sam and if I’m honested is was deserving and had been coming for a few seasons. All we want is some have decent football and some stability.

    Now about the protests, I don’t believe that either newc or Liverpool fans have gone to the extreme of starting a new football club to protest against owners. I mean how many trophies? And you still whinge on.

    Finally all reigns come to an end, the next manager comes in rips the team
    apart. Then we will see who is calling for a messiah, in steps Roy Kean.

  44. Toonlad says:

    What an ignorant uninformed piece of shite this article is.
    Travel to away grounds & speak to proper rival fans more and stop using the Sun (and other red tops) as your source for all things about other clubs.
    In other words get an education and learn to develop your own opinions instead of believing negative stereotypes.

    As for Allardyce, we had a squad capable of playing attacking football but he always sent the team out to park a stall and go for the draw playing hoofball – home & away (without a plan B once we fell behind); not something you’d want to have the pleasure of paying £600+ for like many of us had – especially when you’ve been used to watching free-flowing attacking football from your club.
    We couldn’t even beat Derby that season (Lost 1 and Drew 1), who ended up finishing rock bottom with the lowest ever tally of points in the Premier League.
    If you really admire him that much, why not call for his appointment when Fergie inevitably retires and put your words into actions?

  45. Ian says:

    Spoken like a true Man U supporter.

    You neatly label all Newcastle fans as deluded and ‘self-proclaimed’ best fans in the world and them skim over Man U’s “Sack Fergie, Sell Giggs”… ‘brigade’ from the early 2000s.

    Nice generalisation there buddy.

    There is no wrong in aspiring to be better than you are or, for that matter, fans wanting the team to be better than they are.

    In the case of Newcastle, these ‘protesters’ were still turning up (50 odd thousand) every other week to watch *and support* the team. Allardyce was one of the many managers to suck the creativity and passion out of the play and introduce stagnant, boring football. Did he deserve the sack? Most likely not, ‘given time’ he maybe would turn things around but this is what happens when new owners come into a club.

    Managers and teams have to capture the imagination of the fans. Did Keegan do that? Yes. Did Sir Bobby Robson do that? Absolutely! Does Mourinho do that? (I can’t say that Ferguson does but his team and tactics generally do.)

    Does Allardyce? Does Hodgson?

    What? No, didn’t think so.

    I’m not saying it’s the only thing that matters but there’s a difference between playing well/entertaining and losing and playing rubbish and losing (like Newcastle in recent years and more recently Liverpool).

    Tom, it’s so easy to look down criticise when you’re sitting at the top of the league from a position of relative stability (due in no part to the awesome Alex Ferguson).

    Liverpool are in a transitional period. If they don’t get a grip, they’ll be firmly embedded in mid-table mediocrity and no different to Newcastle, Aston Villa, Spur, although the latter are building a good foundation with an excellent manager. The fans have a right to protest against this. The spirit and uniqueness of the ‘big’ clubs are being muddied by managers that are not good enough. Let Hodgson cut his teeth on lower sides; Liverpool was too big a jump from him. Fair enough, if the club don’t want (or can’t) get seasoned managers, they get what they deserve. Again, the fans have a right to protest against it.

    If Man U were in the same situation (Ferguson sacked, Allardyce or Hodgson in), there would be riots in Moss Side.

    Best Fans In The World™?

    The phrase goes, “We are the *loyalest* football supporters…”

    and it’s a song.

    Every set of fans like to think this. Man U are no different.

  46. Tom Addison says:

    @ Leeds Utd will never be defeated: I wasn’t around to be one of those fans in the 80s, I’m sure there were quite a few nobheads which, relating to your other point, I highlighted in the post, the “Sack Fergie, Sell Giggs” brigade as they were known. Every club has them, including your violent lot. Whether our fans had a sense of entitlement, had a messiah complex back then, I’ll leave to you people who were around then (assuming you were?!) to debate.

    @ Red2death: I never said I supported Hodgson, I even said I think he should go, having read Inverting The Pyramid before he was appointed I was well aware of the type of football he was going to lean towards, although I still thought he’d do better than he is.

    As I pointed out, it’s the messiah complex, the sense of entitlement, the way you got on his back way too early, that’s the problem.

  47. jons says:

    Write something useful, the article should be saved buy fans of other teams and stuffed down your throat when AF retires, and when all your overpaid some very over rated stars decide they don’t want to be there. And start doing as they wish a couple of seasons after AF has gone. As, yes they all kiss the badge now, who wouldn’t if you got paid stupid money, but they have no loyalty. I agree at the moment Man u have one big bubble of success but so did Liverpool and blackpool even further back. All theit bubbles burst. Now I can’t wait for Man U,s to. Then all the supporters around the UK and the very few in Manchester cam then again read this post when I re post it.

  48. Toonlad says:

    What an ignorant uninformed piece of poo this article is.
    Travel to away grounds & speak to proper rival fans more and stop using the Sun (and other red tops) as your source for all things about other clubs.
    In other words get an education and learn to develop your own opinions instead of believing negative stereotypes.

    As for Allardyce, we had a squad capable of playing attacking football but he always sent the team out to park a stall and go for the draw playing hoofball – home & away (without a plan B once we fell behind); not something you’d want to have the pleasure of paying £600+ for like many of us had, especially when you’ve been used to watching free-flowing attacking football from your club.
    That’s all us Geordies ask for, not a trophy or Europe although that would be nice, but value for money in the form of exciting to watch football.
    We couldn’t even beat Derby that season (Lost 1 and Drew 1), who ended up finishing rock bottom with the lowest ever tally of points in the Premier League.
    If you really admire him that much, why not call for his appointment when Fergie inevitably retires and put your words into actions?

  49. Jay says:

    I don’t think Man Utd fans and journalists should bother writing an article on Liverpool, you are far superior as a football team and always will be, Liverpool fans are known to be the thickest fans in the world, scousers are thief’s, liars and must possess the highest percentage of the unemployed in England.
    You should leave them to stew in there own shite, this is the most entertaining thing that has happened to them in ages, the get Woy out saga is the main topic in there lives at the moment, and I for one would prefer that than them breaking into cars and pissing up walls.

  50. Lyle says:

    Hi Tommy I’m sorry but you just do not understand, Allardyce did not have a clue at Newcastle the football was terrible to watch.Although your possibly right we might not have been relegated,but Tommy you miss the point mate we hate negative football.That is what he gave us,we would obviously love to win a trophy but what you lot will never understand Geordies put entertainment first.Until people like you get that into your skull then please keep your ill informed assumptions mistrusts,resentments and loathing and lazy stereotyping to those who really understand football.

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