On the 29th of May 1968, Manchester United became the first English team to win the European Cup exactly ten years after an air disaster would have destroyed lesser clubs. Cross town rivals Manchester City had just won the First Division Championship for only the second – and so far the last time in their history, just eighteen days earlier. Does anyone remember that? Of course not, by becoming Champions of Europe United took all the media limelight while City had to be content with nothing more than a domestic title. You almost had to feel sorry for City fans who had waited since 1937 to have a sniff of such success!
That young kid at the bottom of the photo will be nearly on his old age pension by now, manager Joe Mercer, his assistant Malcolm Allison and some of those players are sadly no longer with us, man had not yet landed on the moon and the Vietnam war was still raging. Television was mainly watched in black and white by most of the world, the internet could not even be imagined and not only mobile phones were still years into the future, most homes did not even have a landline.
So why is this history lesson being raised on a Manchester United fans blog? For one reason. Since a Sheik in the Middle East started pouring petro dollars into Manchester City, all the talk has been about the Blues becoming the biggest club in town leaving United to trail in their shadow. The reality of the above tells us otherwise. City manager Roberto Mancini proudly proclaimed after the scoreless derby last week that ‘we are now the equal of United’ – really signor?
Only a fool, or maybe a frustrated Blue, can possibly believe that ONE result, ONE title or even ONE trophy of some sort can wipe out decades of failure by one club and success by the other. Should City ever manage to win a Premier League title nothing will change. They managed to do it 42 years ago yet the status quo was not only maintained, it was further enforced.
Irrespective of what the Sheik and signor Mancini say, they know as well as anyone that Manchester United will never, ever walk in the shadow of the Blues.
Will Manchester City finish the season ahead of United?
This article sums up just how pathetic your fans are. I hate City but I can’t stand Uniteds “fans”, your all shit. “Can anyone outside Manchester remember this?” Ofcourse they can, because 80% of your “fans” have never been to Manchester. Deep down you know City will beat you to number 20. Your going to be fuck all in a few seasons time and I can’t wait untill your writing for a City blog. I mean half the people who read this probably supported Leeds 10 year ago. Your fans are shit, worst fans in the country, Old Trafford is full of Malaysians, away days up there are so shit, your fans never sing, Old Trafford is silent and your shite of supporters don’t deserve the sucess you’ve had.
On first reading of this article, one could think that it is a patronising account of a club that most Man Utd fans cannot relate to, but to delve further into it, reveals a fear that can not only be smelled but also tasted.
City are coming, football is cyclic and there is nothing anyone can do. Fans of Utd, under 25 years of age, will not be able to comprehend this, but older fans will explain it to them. Alex Ferguson has done a fantastic job but the game is up, the money is gone and average players cannot over achieve for ever.
On a lighter note, the banner at the top is what can only be described as ironic: “Manchester is my Heaven” – yes, it is a magical place that you can only dream of being part of!
Keep your comments coming Sean, they give us all a good laugh. So City will beat us to number 20 eh? They have to win 18 of them before we win just two! How much money are you prepared to wager on that happening? Of course 80% of United fans have never been to Manchester, maybe more. Just remember that City only belong to one part of Manchester, whoever your club is only belongs to its little patch, Manchester United belongs to the world. By the way mate, what have Malaysians ever done to you?
Manchester United ‘belongs to the world’ because the club management cynically exploited the disaster, using it as a marketing tool to gain sympathy and recruit fans.
The fan base escalated further because people from places with no football tradition or even club latched on to United’s success. It is only natural for nine year olds, whether from Dublin, Dubai or Disneyland, want to follow a succesful team. Then there are the legions of adult ‘glory hunters’ who jumped on the bandwagon. Factor in Roy Keane’s ‘prawn sandwich munchers’, mainly there thanks to corporate hospitality and you have 95% of United’s fan base.
None of the above is anything to brag about, imo.
I am a Mancunian, though I now live abroad. I’ve followed City since 1954, a season in which they were by no means successful. Somehow, even in those days, they were ‘Manchester’s team’ whereas United seemed more Salford/Stretford/Sale/Altrincham’s. They were also my father’s and grandfather’s team, just as they are now my daughter’s and my own grandson’s.
I do not begrudge United their success. They are a well-run club, fronted by a brilliant (though unlovable) manager. But the arrogance of their fans is exceeded only by the same fans’ delusion. Things move on and the writing is on the wall for United – any fool can see that financially they are in dire straits and that the frightening Fergie has got the metaphorical sticky tape and glue out to hold things together for a bit longer.
When the inevitable happens, as a Mancunian I will not gloat. But I might permit myself a ‘told you so’.
trafford fans, a bitter and obsessed bunch. ‘manchester united belongs to the world’ ? what a load of shite frank you old tosser. manchester united belongs to the bank. :o) you look like a bit of an old fart frank, you’ll probably escape the worst of the trauma in years to come like slur alix ferguscum.
why do utd fans go on and on about city?…yes we all know your living in fear of city’s first trophy for god knows how long and that once that curse is broken city will go on to dominate football in england and europe but for gods sake just enjoy your own success while you can and forget city!
city will deserve all your spiteful comments in the years to come when utd are just a club with a past and city dominate football!!!!! tick tock, tick tock….
Here come the Blues – as expected. Yes tublu, I not only look but I AM an old fart and guess what? I’m totally proud of it. I have already described myself as being exactly that in a very recent article. And Mick Travis, glory hunters do NOT fall in love with a club which was nearly destroyed by a tragedy. Club management did not NEED to ‘cynically exploit a disaster’ because Manchester United was already a far bigger and more successful club than City and most football clubs ever were, even before Munich. Do you both resent the undisputable FACT that United belongs to the world? Please tell me, either of you, which English club is more loved and respected in ANY country on earth? You already know the answer to that so here’s a word of advice – learn to live with it.
Tell me the difference tublu between belonging to a bank and belonging to an oil sheik who can easily get tired of his toy OR lose his wealth once the liquid gold dries up as it eventually must.
There’s a very good reason why City fans are known as bitters, the two of you have given the evidence of it. And Mick, I’m sorry but you will never get a chance to say ‘told you so’ in your lifetime. City winning another 16 Premierships to catch up with United will simply never happen.
@ming the merciless, City will NEVER be able to dominate English and European football and you know it. As for your question as to ‘why do utd fans go on and on about city?’ It’s very simple. It has nothing to do with ‘living in fear’ or the tick tocking of an imaginary clock as you suggested but the simple fact that the Blue pretenders now think that they are a much bigger club than what they really are.
There’s an old saying that if you want to make a fortune, simply buy an Argentinian for what he’s REALLY worth then sell him for what he THINKS he’s worth! Manchester City fans now seem to have gotten that same mentality!
Lets face it Frank.
To say that we will never win 18 titles is a joke. Even you can tell that anything, however unlikely it may seem to your desperate brain, is possible. (Quite frankly, some things are very very possible. Likely, i think the word is. And that is 18 titles coming to Eastlands in the near future)
But lets look at this another way.
All this success that United have had? Where did it come from? Money.
What don’t United have anymore? Money. Ocean Finance. (I’d get the number for you and old bacon chin, but I believe he’s had them on speed dial begging for pennies for months)
Truth is. United are in decline. The only team from manchester are on the incline.
And if you don’t believe it – we’ll just buy your club, stadium and all of the horrible reminants of a broken power and sell it to one of those theme park owners from Scooby Doo.
So pipe down. Live with the new reality
Utd fans go on about the 35 years all the time and how they have history but seem to have wiped the 37 years(1911-1948) they won fuck all from it. I forgot football only started in 1992 to most utd fans
Matthew, you have got the better of me because I really don’t know what you’re on about. What’s the Ocean Finance connection? Do you mean Sir Alex by ‘old bacon chin’? Has he been trying to raise money for United? What’s your theme park reference about? Do you mean the Glazers will be selling Old Trafford to a Disneyland type theme park?
It’s all a little bit extreme isn’t it? The ‘only team from Manchester’? Tell that to a world who sees United and United alone as THE Manchester club. Do you REALLY consider City winning 18 titles in the near future as anything BUT a joke?
If you consider all this to be the NEW REALITY, please, let me know where I can get some of whatever you must be on. No offence meant Matthew but you sound just like Liverpool fans have done for the last 20 years.
There’s only one reality mate, irrespective of whether it’s new or old. Until City can match 18 titles, 3 European Cups and too many other trophies to mention, it will remain irrelevant in the world of major football clubs.
So you REALLY want to go back 62 years bluemoon? Tell me what honours United has won since 1948 compared to City. You can also include the odd derby win if you want.
Fuck me,what a pointless article,whoever Frank is,then try and get out a bit more.
u blue bitters… hopefully you’ll finally win a trophy cos with ur success u will attract glory hunters as well… so just shut the fuck up and do the talkin on the pitch!
Frank, you haven’t even got a local name. Are you from Milton Keynes as well? Your comments are like so many that I hear from the Nouveaux Rouge. I even heard one half-wit outside the ground last Wednesday, when several other half-wits were trying to brek down the Police & Steward cordon to try to gain entry without tickets, say “they’re not used to big games here are they?” The answer to that is simple – against which teams have record attendances been posted at Eastlands? Answer – Chelsea and Liverpool. Why? Because their fans know how to behave themselves and don’t have to have their allocations reduced. For United matches all over the place these days, their allocations are reduced.
Indeed some might say that at home they don’t need them reducing now because there seems to be some natural wastage there.
By the way the tick-tock reference is not necessarily a clock ticking..it is the uncontrollable debt ticking forward. The debt introduced to your Club by a yank who saw it as a cash cow to fund his other business interests and has done so. Maybe Michel Platini is behind that or maybe it was planned some where in the Middle East.
If I was a Stretford, I too would be proud of my team’s history, but do you know, somebody has to make tomorrow’s history. Knowing City it could well be a new history of boom and bust on a meteoric scale, but the answer is to enjoy whatever it is whilst it lasts..or even gets off the ground.
Don’t forget that your friends from the other end of the East Lancs Road (that’s a road that links Manchester & Liverpool for Malaysians and Milton Keynes folk) dominated football for many years, including scoring many goals at the end of matches, like you do, although in their case it was often before added time. Your team has done exceptionally well domestically but has not pulled its weight in Europe as it should have done with the resources available.
Chelsea looks to be on the wane a bit, as does United. Arsenal are playing everybody’s dream football but it has made them inconsistent. City are playing everybody’s nightmare football but are still fourth. Changes are a-coming. You can no longer splash £28m for the likes of Veron, £30m for Ferdinand, £28m for Rooney and all the rest of it.
I don’t like the impatience angle to what’s happening at City but in the end it will deliver and your team will have to start catch-up proceedings as new history gets created.
Sean you are a nutcase in need of professional psychological assessment. and Mick if you really are from Manchetser you would know that you summing up our fanbase as 95% coroparate plus glory hunters is a complete and utter load of rubbish. Therefore I must deduce that you are either not from Manchester or more than likely are just doing that bitter blue thing where they try to perpetuate a myth they came up with that there are no Manchester Fans in Manchester. Sad really but there you go. You tell yourself whatever you need to to get through the day lads. 🙂
@ pedmachine. You have lost me, what do you class as a ‘local name’? Is ‘pedmachine’ an example of one?
Danny, I’m not sure what ‘coroporate’ means. I AM sure that the vast majority of United fans are the sort of people who wouldn’t be seen dead following anything other than an extremely successful team.
The other thing I am sure of is that there’s an unease amounting almost to hysteria among United fans concerning City’s sudden acquisition of wealth. On the odd occasion I venture on to a Man U fansite (inevitably suckered in by a mention on the City ‘News Now’, I should know better) the air of fear and foreboding is so strong you can almost smell it!
As evidence, I’d cite this thread. Superficially, the above thread is somewhat pointless as it preaches to the converted. It’s a site for United fans and Frankie the Red isn’t telling them anything they don’t know.
Subliminally, however, Frankie’s mission is a dual one – to wind up City fans (bit childish, but hey we all love pissing off the opposition); and at the same time, assuage the fears of United fans over the potential rise-and-rise of the Blues.
Danny Boy, so far as my allegiance to ‘Manchetser’ is concerned, I grew up residing no more than 400 yards from the Town Hall clock. My old man was born in Hart Street (demolished to make way for Chorlton Street bus station) and, tracing my ancestors, I’ve recently found that his dad came from Minshull Street, off Piccadilly. You can hardly get more ‘Manchetserian’ than that. To complete the picture, I now live and work in Dublin where I’m surrounded by glory hunters whose allegiance to United dates mainly from after the demise of Liverpool.
Frankie, old fruitcake, your claim that United are the “most loved” is sheer nonsense. I’d bet that if you took a poll among the world’s football supporters United would be designated the “World’s Most Hated Club”. And maybe as much for the sheer unbridled arrogance of their fans as for their success.
Finally,it’s a mistake to assume it’s a matter of mere mathematics. 18 titles or no, if City win three titles in the next decade and United win none, which set of fans would be the happier?
Sorry Mick, I will have to write a complete new article to respond to your comments and I have no intention of repeating myself. Suffice to say that City winning three titles in the next decade is not a big deal, United won that many in the last four years. And yes, United may well be the “World’s Most Hated Club” amongst its many envious rivals. Does that really surprise you? Envy is a very powerful emotion mate.
Come now Mick are we going to resort to picking out typing errors or discuss football? If you are as linked to Manchester as you claim then you would know that what you are saying is complete crap mate im afraid. Always has been and always will be a myth made up by City fans. I live just off the East Lancs in Boothstown where you will be hard pushed to find a city fan and almost every taxi driver ive ever met in Manchester and the surrounding area is a Man United fan not city, nor are they ‘corporate’ or glory hunters and their United support tends to go back at least a couple of generations. You are simply making accusations that you cannot back up with any fact or evidence and I reckon are just as guilty as being on the wind up as Frank was with the original article 🙂 As for Hysteria among United fans about City, as I said, keep telling yourself whatever you need to get through the day pal 🙂 All talk no susbstance, same old City.
Sorry Frankie, but you are terribly misguided. The reason why football fans hate Man U is not for their success. They may envy it, yes, but ‘hatred’ and ‘envy’ are two very different things. It’s the sheer unbridled arrogance of the majority of United fans that get up peoples’ noses – as witness the tripe contained in your lead article.
Danny, Boothstown? Isn’t that a suburb of Wigan? (Only joking mate, I wouldn’t wish the Pie-eaters on anyone.) Yes of course I was exaggerating and it rattled a few cages I see. And sorry to be nitpicky over your typos, a bit mean that – five years spent as a sub-editor gave me an eye for these things.
Let me say I’ve no objection to your sort of United fan. I suspect I could sit in a pub with you and rattle on about the merit of our respective squads over a few pints, agreeing to disagree. It’s only the loonies I object to, like those guys who graffiti-daubed the pub last week. Anyhow, I reckon ten per cent of every club’s fans are total nutters, ours included. Unless you count Wigan where it’s nearer thirty per cent. One of my misgivings over the City renaissance is that we might attract the wrong sort along the way – total glory hunters and Blues from God knows where who wouldn’t be able to find Eastlands if you stood them on top of the Hilton with the Jodrell Bank telescope. Sound familiar?
Finally, as for “getting through the day”, all I need is good food, drink and music. Hysteria? Well maybe that’s a bit strong but the new money at City plus the Glaser’s shenanigans has brought a deal of doom’n’gloom to even rabid Red fansites like Republik of M.
ps Thanks for the tip off. I now have one more reason for hating taxi drivers.
United support tends to go back a couple of weeks at most. Taxi-drivers only say that they support Man U cos they think it may get them a tip off all the Malaysian tourists. There are thousands and thousands of so-called United fans who don’t know where Manchester is let alone attended a game at the swamp. can you imagine what it will be like when Taggart eventually realises he’s past it and that his drink problem really has taken hold. The new manager will have the shadow of bacon-face always hanging over him like an everlasting ongoing nightmare whispering words of poison in the background. Crap team, crap fans, crap future.
Fair comments John, thanks. Yes, the Munich survivors episode was a shameful one for the club. It has hopefully learned a lesson from it with the purchase of Nobby Stiles medals an indication of it.
you forgot to mention city loaned united players after munich,you also forgot to mention city let united use our beloved maine rd after old trafford was targeted off the luftwaffe,and you also forgot to mention city gave you “used kit” to use when united was last skint like you deserve to be “rags”.and you will probably beg for help again in the future because WE ARE AND ALWAYS WILL BE IMPECCABLE.
There’s got to be something wrong with a club that has turned over 14 or 15 managers – forgive me, I lost count, since the Premier League commenced! During that time, United has had just one.
Well as a 65 year old City fan who was at Newcastle when we won the league i do agree with you on the history of your sucess over the years.City will never be as big as you and it is only on the pitch that we will match you.Yeh its been a long road for us fans and especialy for the younger ones who have not seen us win anything over the long years.Lets hope that this will change with all the money being pumped in.Still on the history part tell us what club waited for 40 years to put a game on for the suvivors of the Munich crash,when alot of them were skint over the years and resorted to selling their medals.Oh it was your glorious club wasnt it and to turn the game into a farwell to the Frog when us older ones know that he would not have kicked a ball for you again after Palace game if Sir Matt had been manager,now he was class.
Only a fool, or maybe a frustrated Blue, can possibly believe that ONE result, ONE title or even ONE trophy of some sort can wipe out decades of failure by one club and success by the other
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Find me a blue who thinks this and I’ll buy you a drink; though I must odd that this article is *so* stupid that I wonder if you can get a glass to your mouth without dumping the contents on your lap. I have my doubts.
So, tell me, if you are a historian of Manchester football, tell me what Sir Matt was about to do when he changed his mind and joined City. Then tell me what Louis Edwards was about to be investigated over when he – lucky for him – dropped dead. The tell me how he bought up all the shares in United.
Over to you … watch it! You’re spilling your beer
You are asking a lot of irrelevant questions Jeremy BUT if you want to bring up former owners like those never to be lamented Louis Edwards and his son Martin, I will just throw in one name – former Thailand prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra. You also ask to “Find me a blue who thinks this and I’ll buy you a drink”. Think of your own manager – for the time being, who boasted last week that ‘we are now the equal of United’
Mancini’s claim was not boasting. It was a statement if fact. We are ascending, you are going down and we’ve met, momentarily, in the middle. On a point of information, I can’t recall us lending them a player after Munich but we did lend them our ground after WW2 at a time when United would have folded if we hadn’t.
Shinawatra and Louis Edwards were cast in the same mould – one killed drug dealers and political opponents; the other poisoned schoolkids and hospital patients with his dodgy meat.
Absolutely correct Mick, Shinawatra and Edwards are a blot on the history of both clubs. Yes, a lot of English institutions did many wonderful things in the wake of WW2 and credit to all of them. I must disagree with your assessment of Signor Mancini’s comment however. Nobody can possibly deny that thanks to the Sheiks petro dollars, City is obviously on the ascendancy but are United REALLY on the way down? Three Premier League titles in the last four years, runners up last season, a Champions League winner and a finalist in two of the last three years and sitting within three points of the leaders while being undefeated for eight months.
Is that an indication that Manchester United are on the way down? Stating that City are now EQUAL with Manchester United is nothing more than wishful thinking by Mancini. Blues fans have made it abundantly clear that they want to see the back of the scarf wearing Italian who thinks that fans are on his back simply because he’s not British. It looks like ANOTHER manager is about to occupy the hot seat at Eastlands, the question is For How Long?
Busby. Would you see him as the source of all your success as a club? If so, you should know, that when when he signed for City, he was just about to emigrate to the USA. So not only did we save your bacon after the war (though you would not know it given United’s attitude towards us) we also secured Busby for you.
So there’s a point of view that quite reasonably suggests that your success is down to our supreme generosity 🙂
Anyway, the poster above is right. We are on the up. and you are on the cusp of your glory, and the only way is down. Your current squad lacks the character that has epitomised Ferguson’s teams. Hopefully we will spoil his retirement 🙂
“Blues fans have made it abundantly clear that they want to see the back of the scarf wearing Italian”
In your dreams. I guess the boos at Stamford Bridge means Chelsea fans want Ancelotti out?
“Your current squad lacks the character that has epitomised Ferguson’s teams.” Jeremy, did you write this before or after United’s game at Villa Park on Saturday?
Let’s just get one thing clear Frank. Most City fans don’t want to see the back of ‘Scarf Ace’. No one except for a small minority of noisy neurotic know-nothing nutters (and every club has them) wants to go back to the anarchy and chaos that was City’s modus operandi in the Swales days and after. Nor do we think that sacking Mancini and installing Martin O’Neill or Goose would do anything to improve things. Most of us are happy with the progress made – City with a decent defence, for godssakes. How long is it since we had one of those.
I think Jeremy is right. You are on “the cusp of your glory” sums it up well. United are in decline. It will be a very slow slide from a very high peak but it will happen. Financially you are unstable. Given football’s cruel economics I can’t see you sustaining at previous levels, particularly after the amazing Fergie retires.
Unlike other City fans I don’t hate the guy. He does come across as unlovable but dammit, he’s not Thatcher, Amin or Pol Pot. I am full of admiration for the way his teams never capitulate (though occasionally I wonder if referees’ watches are AIG branded). At the moment he’s doing a sterling job of papering over the cracks with a squad of extremely uneven quality. But it surely can’t last.
Finally, nice blog, keep it going. I’ve enjoyed the banter. Over and out.
Thanks for your feedback Mick, I thought it was enjoyable as well. See folks, it’s so much better when people are civil to each other instead of simply throwing insults
To answer your question Frank, no, I very much doubt it.
I didn’t read Mancini’s statement, but it’s an absurd thing to say, if he said it.
No more absurd than the things that come out of your own manager’s mouth on a weekly basis though, the most recent example being his ridiculous hypocrisy in banging on about the Tevez poster when his own stadium has had the XX Years banner for several years.
@Blue Mick, these links to both The Telegraph and The Sun have both reported what I wrote. I know you understand that I cannot speak directly to managers and can only repeat what’s reported in the press. The Telegraph – “Roberto Mancini: now Manchester City and Manchester United are equals after Eastlands draw” – http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-city/8125156/Roberto-Mancini-now-Manchester-City-and-Manchester-United-are-equals-after-Eastlands-draw.html
The Sun “City chief Roberto Mancini had even claimed his team were now on an equal level to United. But he is fooling himself” – http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3221365/Manchester-City-0-Manchester-United-0.html
As for the hypocrisy about the XX Years banner, even Mancini’s assistant Brian Kidd has admitted that ‘The banner is fair. It is a fact. It is no good talking about ifs, buts and maybes. That is it. It is staring every one of us in the face. We have got to face it up and deal with it. So what if they have got the banner up? They’ve got the banner up. No big deal.”
Frank,
So, like I said, in that case it’s an absurd thing to say.
Ah, the Bible According to Brian Kidd. Sorry, my mistake then.
All the best with your Cut & Paste beliefs.
Mick